The Cinephile's Aisle
Two film haters and a microphone covering cinema classics, box office blockbusters, and everything in between!
The Cinephile's Aisle
Episode 19: Christmas by the Reels
What makes a movie the Christmas movie? Is it the cozy vibes, holiday spirit, or just a snow-covered backdrop? On this episode, we tackle the big question, share our personal favorite Christmas movies, and even debate the eternal question: is Love Actually really a Christmas movie?
Plus, we take on the challenge of reimagining non-Christmas movies as holiday films! From classics to unexpected picks, this episode is packed with fun, spirited debates, and plenty of holiday cheer.
Tune in for all the festive feels!
Find us on Instagram, Twitter, and YouTube at @CinephilesAisle.
Hello, hello, hello. We are back to another episode of the Cinephile's Aisle. And we're back with the OG. You know, we missed you, Steve. Where you been at?
Steve:Well, so I missed last episode, and it felt weird. You know when like your kid goes off to boarding school and like you're handing them off to the teachers, right? And you're like, damn, this kid is really out of my hands now. Like I have no control over what happens for the next three months of this kid's life. That's how I felt. Like when I saw a new episode of the Cinephile's Aisle has been published, and I wasn't part of it. But hey man, shout out, shout out Ayisha. She said I was ducking. I don't know why she said that, but that was very funny. I laughed when I heard that.
Ofili:Yeah, she did. But yeah, I was like, wow. You know, you didn't you don't want to tackle good debate or something. I don't remember what she said exactly, but it was pretty funny. It was it was pretty good. Uh I think that last episode was a pretty fun episode. We dove really deep into Conclave, which as I've mentioned, is one of my favorite movies of the year. I feel like I really didn't like the spot that I was at because in the episode before then, I was like, no, Anora's my favorite movie of the year. Then literally the next week, I go watch Conclave and I'm like, fuck.
Steve:Yeah. I haven't listened to the episode yet because I'm I haven't seen Conclave, so I don't want any spoilers for me.
Ofili:Yeah, I feel like in that episode we did talk quite explicitly about Conclave because fuck, man. We even went to like scene analysis. It's a great fucking movie.
Steve:I'll check it out. It's on streaming now. I think it's Peacock, so I'm going to watch it probably very soon. But I did see Wicked, and I know you guys talked a little bit about Wicked in the last episode.
Ofili:Yeah, we we did like a very brief touch-up on Wicked, then we did the crossover episode, which you can find on the Cinephile's Aisle with me. Sorry, Popcorn For Dinner. Yeah. We didn't publish it. Popcorn For Dinner published theirs. Great episode. I think they also had Mercedes on, who was an extra on Wicked, which was incredibly interesting. I do not know half the things on Wicked were real and built, which is crazy.
Steve:Practical? Wow. That is that is cool. But I guess for a movie of that size and a budget of that size, then practicality is the way to go. It's not like the MCU is probably the only big budget franchise where things are not very practical, you know?
Ofili:Yeah, that makes sense. It has to be that makes sense. I mean, you're running, well, fuck, you know, yeah, I guess so. Because I was thinking, like, with Wicked, like, you know, it's the supernatural elements is just the magic. Whereas with the MCU and superhero stuff, the the problem is like, how do we make these gadgets functional on a day-to-day basis? So I I guess like, you know, different struggles, you know? Yeah. Because I feel like a lot of fantasy stuff is really just like how do we make it look nice? It's still like at the core, the technology is still the same, it's just how it looks. So I feel like that might be easier. But yeah, we're jumping in. Today's topic is Film-bro Christmas, you know? Film-bro Christmas. We don't celebrate Christmas Day. For us, it is cinema day.
Steve:I love that.
Ofili:We have like three crazy movies all coming out on that day and Christmas Day. Honestly, fuck your kids, fuck your wife. Whoa. It is time to spend time at AMC.
Steve:That is it. So this Christmas, I'm spending with my college host family, right? I we try to spend every Christmas together. And I how I don't know how to tell them that I have two really important movies that like my mental health depends on both of these that have to say. Like I just get out of Christmas dinner, you know what I mean?
Ofili:But you gotta go early. You gotta you gotta shoot the 9 a.m. Yeah.
Steve:Before like everyone's up and active and stuff, you know what I mean?
Ofili:Because you know, around like 4 p.m. you're kind of cooked. Yeah, yeah.
Steve:Yeah, yeah, yeah. So I think it's cool that movies that aren't necessarily or aren't even entirely Christmas themed, like they probably don't even have an element of Christmas in them, are coming out on Christmas Day. I don't know if that's bold or I don't even know what to call that, you know.
Ofili:I feel like it's a little bit bold, but I guess, man. But what is a Christmas movie?
Steve:That is a very good question because that's what part of what we're talking about today.
Ofili:Yeah, what is a Christmas movie? Because we the debate is always there. Because in this episode, we're probably gonna go over our favorite Christmas movies. Yeah, and I'm not gonna lie, you know, someone might call me, so you know, someone might come at me when I say Die Hard. That's always a classic.
Steve:That's always the first one that gets dropped in these debates. But what is a Christmas movie? I think for me Christmas has to be central. Yeah, it doesn't have to be the key plot or the central theme, but it has to be central to whatever is going on in the movie. Like it either has to be set during or around Christmas, set during Christmas season, or it has to like imbue the spirit of Christmas, you know? It has to be a plot, it has to be a subplot or something, like it has to be uh centered around Christmas in some way, you know. For it to be a Christmas movie, like basically if this was set, if this film was set during a different period or about you know during a different time of the year, would it change the fit the film substantially? If the answer to that question is yes, then I think it's a Christmas movie.
Ofili:Okay, I get that, but I'm not going to lie. I feel like Home Alone could have been set in the summer.
Steve:Home Alone could have been set in the summer, but it won't have given the same. Like it won't have been the same because sure, like the family's taking a summer break, but like you have you have the the group singing the carol. I don't know why that's stuck in my brain.
Ofili:That could be 4th of July, mate. Like yeah, so the classic question of like what is a Christmas movie that leads to like a lot of these debates, and yeah, for me, I I think I pretty much agree with the same thing. It's like it I don't think how I don't feel like Christmas has to be super central to the plot.
Steve:Yeah.
Ofili:But I guess in some way, like, you know, for diehard, the argument that they make is that it is like a Christmas holiday party. Yeah. You know, yeah, it's in the heart of Christmas, like it's festive.
Steve:So should we go into what some of your favorite Christmas movies are?
Ofili:Oof. This is tough. I feel like this is gonna be another one that's a bit oof. Batman Returns is in my top five.
Steve:Batman Returns is crazy. Okay.
Ofili:I know.
Steve:Okay, that's a lot of things.
Ofili:Tim Barron cooked. Tim Burren Cooked. The 1992. Yeah, Tim Burren cooked on that one. Um, what else am I thinking? I'm thinking it's real Christmas movies, like without a doubt, this is a Christmas movie. This Klaus, the animated one. What other one is there? Really love Tokyo Godfather. That's another, it's deep cut, you know. I'm so sorry. Very niche. What else? What else is there? Of course, we got the Grinch, Tyler the Creator's version, not Jim Carrey, fuck Jim Carrey. I don't care how long you stood out or sat for them to put green feathers all on you. That is sus. I'm just gonna say. Yeah. Um also, did you catch that like apparent Grinch lore that the first like scene, the parents are having a key party, like a swinger's key party?
Steve:No, I don't know why.
Ofili:Like that's why everyone is dropping their keys in the same bowl. It's because at the end of the night, you're gonna like the woman's gonna reach into the bowl and pick out someone's keys. Who's have his key on home with them? Oh, yeah. So I'm like, wow. Because this is it just adds to the fact that like in the 90s, niggas were just doing anything.
Steve:They were just doing anything in these movies and kid shows. Not gonna lie, I know we're not talking about swingers, but that's a really smart idea. I like that idea.
Ofili:I'm fucking dead.
Steve:I'm fucking dead.
Ofili:I think I just went for night before was also a really good one. The Seth Rogan John. Fuck. It's Seth Rogan and Joseph Gordon Levitt, and I don't remember who the black guy is. I've forgotten what his name is. He's a guy that has a smile. He has like the weird smile. He's he's Falcon. Anthony Mackey. Anthony Mackey is in that is I don't know if it's Anthony Mackey. I might be mixing up black people. I think it's Anthony Mackey.
Steve:Yeah, I think it's Anthony Mackey. I'll look it up real quick. Yeah, Anthony Mackey is in there.
Ofili:Yeah, yeah. So I think those are my my quick cuts of like some of my favorite Christmas movies. I'm definitely missing. I missed out the gem that came out last year. Shout out to Dominic Sessa and Joe Randolph. I was on a gem title. The fuck is holdovers, Jesus Christ. You will cry. Yeah. Beautiful film. Okay, let's hear yours. Let's hear overlapping now.
Steve:Yeah, I'm gonna start with Holdovers since you just said that, and it's the most recent as well. I think the Holdovers is so pure. Like, I remember watching that film and feeling like a surge in emotion. Like, I felt like my buddy was just surging with pure emotion. Like the film is so tender and it's so delicate and it's so pure. And you know, like I think that year, last year, um, Gematti won was the only one that the critic's choice award differed with the Oscars for Lead. Like they gave Gematti what the Oscars gave Oppenheimer, but I understood it. Like Gematti is so his family because you've seen him before, and I don't really think of him as that character from the holdovers, you know. Like, I don't know, man. It was so obviously divine joy. She also could deserve Oscar as well.
Ofili:And Dominic Sessor, like you know, I I feel like I just saw Dominic Sessor in an ad for something that was so random. It was like Airbnb or something. I was like, what the fuck?
Steve:I saw him on something, yeah. And I was I was like, wait a while on a Hulu show or something. I saw him on.
Ofili:I'm like, I'm looking for new stuff that he's in, and I'm just like, damn. But back to what you said about Jemadi, it's so interesting that you're like, yeah, Jamadi's the his previous filmography doesn't really it doesn't fit that he's going to be this like emotionally like fucking amazing Christmas movie, mate. Yeah, it doesn't make any sense to me. Because my thing is like I knew him from billions, and he's a character I've always hated. And like the other movies that he dropped, it's just so different to me.
Steve:Yeah, like I'm thinking back to I think I first saw him in Straight Out of Compton, where he's playing like this white music exec who's like a dickhead, like a tough dickhead, you know, and like brutal. And I'm like, this guy, like you're telling me that is this guy, you know. So I completely understand why the critic choice was better than Oppenheimer last year. But the entire film, like all the performances and the score, the score is still moving, the picture is beautiful, so that has to be up there for me immediately. Second one might be crazy, since we're talking about Christmas, but the girl with the dragon tattoo, Jesus fucking Christ, Jesus fucking Christ, ladies and gentlemen.
Ofili:Steve has dropped his film bro pick. This is a film bro Christmas. We are moving out of traditional Christmas. Now we are looking for the edgy, stylized, and overanalyzed film bro Christmas movies. The girl with the dragon tattoos, ladies and gentlemen.
Steve:The girl with the dragon tattoos still remains one of my favorite features. It's not his most popular, you know. It literally shows a rape scene. People don't like that. People are sensitive about that, rightfully so.
Ofili:You know what? Let me let me guess the next one. Let me guess the next one. Is the next one like fucking Eyes Wide Shut by Kubrick? Is that is that it?
Steve:No, no, no, no, no, no.
Ofili:I fucking hate people, bro. Jesus fucking right.
Steve:Girl with the Dragon tattoo is so important because the end of that film, right, is like the central, like for me, that's when the film becomes a classic. Where she gets a Christmas gift and she sees him with his woman and she realizes that all that he had was transactional, you know, which she thought it was kind of like Anora, right? When we've been having discourse. I've had a few conversations with people offline about how they did not like our episode on Honora because we were looking at Anora, we're looking at Annie from a man's perspective. I've had like three people talk to me about this. But if you're liking Anora to the girl with the dragon tattoo, the woman has a realization. She has a moment when she realizes that what they had wasn't love or wasn't like emotion that she thought it was, it was purely transactional. And that's what the movie rests on. The movie doesn't exist without that key sub, like subplot. Now, take that to the girl with the dragon tattoo. She buys the gift, she's going to give it to this man who she feels stained for that she doesn't really know what it is, and she sees him with the woman that he would actually be with. Like, why would he want to be with her when he could be with the woman like this? And she throws the gift away. If that if this wasn't Christmas, why would that wouldn't happen? And the film would have a whole complete different ending. So for me, that's a that's a Christmas movie. I don't care what anyone says.
Ofili:Okay, okay. On your role, let me let me let me guess your number two, you're number three. Okay. Okay. It's either gonna be since we're following this form bowl, cinematic Christmas. We don't give a fuck about the Carolas, we don't give a fuck about the kids. We just want there to be a tree in the background. I'm guessing you're probably gonna toss in in Bruges.
Steve:No. That's a good shout, though. But no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no.
Ofili:Okay, okay. Then maybe I feel like okay, wait, the Hateful Eight.
Steve:Because I feel like that's a good one! Oh, that's a fuck. That's not online, but that definitely has to be we have to say that's a Christmas film. I like that. Oh my god, that is a Christmas film. Yeah, yeah, yeah. That is a Christmas film. But no, my third one is is a Sathic classic. It's called Carol. I think that's Todd Haynes. Um Carol's good.
Ofili:Carlos.
Steve:Yeah, Rooney Mara and Kate Blanchett. Um, it's a Christmas film, though. It's not just because there's trees and stuff, it's centered up, it's set around Christmas. The plot has nothing to do with Christmas, but it's set around Christmas, and a lot of the things or a lot of the things that Haynes is able to explore in the film are possible because of Christmas. I think I like a good low-key sapphic or low-key gay drama. I think I enjoy that where nothing is happening, you're just like following lives and following the story that the artist is able to paint.
Ofili:Yeah, Steve always talking about some elevated romance, quote unquote elevated, man.
Steve:But those are great though. Like those are actually, you know, really because that's when you get to see, like, they're carried by the script and the acting. You don't need any of that extra, you know, you don't need the VFX, you don't need the CGI, you don't need nothing else. You just need pure, pure hoops, bro. Pure hoops. Pure hoops, bro. And like for me, that's Carol is Carol is great. I almost shed it here watching that. And then my last one, I'm gonna go with the classic Love Actually. Very classic. I rewatched it this year. I think I've watched it every year since the first time I watched it, really. It's like a tradition for me at this point. And I'm going to say something that we said earlier about if you take the film and set it in a different time, then it's a whole different film. Valentine's Day and Love Actually are essentially the same movie. Valentine's Day is an ensemble, it's just set in the US and it's set around Valentine's Day. Love actually is set around Christmas in the UK. And you see that there are different films, you know, same like concepts of get a bunch of A-listers and have them play intertwined lives and blah blah blah, and someone's falling in love and someone's breaking up and all of that. But love actually feels very differently from Valentine's Day because of Christmas. So that's why that's what I mean about like Christmas film. If you said it in a different time and it's changes the film significantly or substantially, then it's a Christmas film.
Ofili:Alright, we're gonna I feel like honestly, I'm I'm gonna dedicate maybe three to four minutes on debating whether love actually is a Christmas film because you've started something, and I feel like there is enough there is enough to fight against.
Steve:Bro, look up the cover of Love Actually, look up the I've seen it.
Ofili:I know there's a bow. I know there's a bow on Love Actually. Get out of here. First of all, Christmas is just a backdrop. Let's just be honest. You just said it, you gave, you gave me, you gave me the ammo for that. You said it's the same movie as Valentine's Day, same exact concept. So the focus conceptually, it's the same movie, it's not the same movie. Come on, exactly. It could take it, it could take place during any other festive or romantic time of the year. But it changes not really. You just said that it doesn't. You just said because it can take place, it's the same film as Valentine's Day. Meaning Christmas is not a core theme of the film.
Steve:It is though. So there are literally what how is it it opens with a has been singer trying to report, like re-record a Christmas jingle that he made like years past, but he's past his prime now. And like the the song, it's like Mariah Carey trying to record, we record all I want for Christmas, it's you, and that's like her plot line for the entire film. That's Christmas right there. It wouldn't it wouldn't work if we had something else, you know? I had another time, and people are coming back for the holidays and people are a question.
Ofili:I got a question though. Okay, okay. Does the prime minister only fall in love with his assistant during Christmas? Is that just a Christmas thing? Like they only fall in love with his Christmas. How does that make sense? That's not even traditional Christmas values, man.
Steve:But you feel like Hallmark, Hallmark built a whole franchise based on love in the air during Christmas.
Ofili:Yes, but it's also about being around family and retracing your roots. That's regular Christmas story, those are regular Christmas values, mate. For this one, this movie is just, I'm not gonna lie. I feel like the more the central plots of if I do remember, because I haven't watched love acting in a couple of years, but it's more about love, career struggles, like you mentioned. And a little bit of cheating, but we're talking about this.
Steve:I feel like there's like a couple people cheating in that movie that is like okay. Some of what you're saying makes sense, yes, obviously. Like one of the couples, their thing is about how the best friend of the guy is in love with the bride, whatever, and that can happen anytime. But again, the spirit of Christmas is evident through the movie. It's like the spirit of Christmas brings out something in the people, right? Like it makes the film feel more you can say the film about love like Valentine's Day and have that be said whenever during the year, right? And that's it will be lovely and romantic, but you said it during Christmas, everyone is already cheesy, everyone is in this bubbly, you know, Jesus is born, love your neighbor, blah blah blah, feel, and that adds an element to it, adds a layer to it. It brings out an extra level of cheesiness that makes the romantic comedy I just romantic, dude.
Ofili:I just fucking remembered. Didn't Snape cheat on his wife in that movie, Alan Wickman, and his wife in the movie. Yeah, like he he was one of the characters with the infidelity thing.
Steve:And it was so there's a lot of cynicism in that film. But what who says, like, where all those Hallmark films when they go back, you know, there's cheating involved. Like, cheating has happened in Hallmark. This is not the first, it wouldn't be the first Christmas film to have cheating happen. Like, it's not like it's never happened before. Netflix just dropped the Christmas banger, no banger, a really shit one.
Ofili:Really shit.
Steve:It was really shit.
Ofili:Oh, the Lindsay Lohan one.
Steve:Oh, that's yeah, yeah, that's the one I'm talking about. They just dropped the really shit one with Lindsay Lohan, and there's cheating in it. Okay, so I'm talking about the Christina Milan one.
Ofili:What's that called? There's a no, it's the black one. It's got Christina Milan, it's got coffee cerebral. It's it's it's equally shit.
Steve:It's equally shit, it's crazy.
Ofili:The problem is just that it's just POC shit. Oh, meet me next Christmas. Yeah, yeah, that that's it. And it's like it's very weird because like they there's like a concert, there's a Christmas concert. Instead of it being Mari Carey or maybe Beyonce, it's pentatonics. I was like, Pentatonics is headlining for Christmas, and like their tickets are going for like hundreds of dollars, like 300 or something. Then you have scalpers selling it for crazy. Then you look at the venue and you're like, what the fuck?
Steve:So I'm not gonna lie, I'm laughing, but but I'm a pentatonics fan, I can't afford it. Well, of course I know you're yeah, but that's that's funny. That's yeah, no.
Ofili:I don't I don't think like pentatonics should headline your Christmas.
Steve:Yeah, yeah, I agree. Yeah, completely but but anyway, back to the topic. Cheating is not like literally exclusive from a Christmas film, is what I'm trying to do.
Ofili:What do you mean? How it's Christmas films are literally about like morals, reflection, being a good person. It's about finding your true love.
Steve:If you have to cheat, no, it's the person that you're with, exactly. And the Christmas lesson is that the person I'm with, I have to come clean to her, or I have to let this go, and I have to be with the person, or conversely, my partner is cheating on me. This isn't for me. I have to be strong and I have to like find real love and not settle for this nonsense.
Ofili:It's about they go back to their family because the holidays are about family. Mate, what are we doing here? My man said, don't let your your your wife stop you from finding your true love.
Steve:Yeah, I said, bro, bro, this is crazy. Christmas love actually, a little bit of cheating here and there, a little bit of you know things that we're not supposed to be doing, but ultimately it all ties in, right? There's a central theme of friendship, family, love. And love actually does all of those things. Career, yes, but friendship, family, love, and yeah.
Ofili:Okay, okay. I'm I'm gonna leave you with that. I'm gonna leave you with that. How do you feel about kiss kiss bang bang? I think I've seen that. Downey Jr., I felt like that would probably be on your list because you you are like a you're an RDJ. Let me stop.
Steve:You you be glazing, you be glazing like crazy. RDJ is crazy. No, I haven't seen that. I can't. I can't think I even knew this movie existed before just now.
Ofili:No, it's a pretty, it's it's it's it's what it's a under the set of film brew cinema movies, cinema Christmas movies. Oh, so I'm gonna throw out a description right now and tell me whether you would watch this or not.
Steve:Okay.
Ofili:Okay. Directed by Tarantino, starting Kevin McAllister.
Steve:Okay.
Ofili:Okay. He's dropping one-liners like Merry Christmas, you filthy animals, slow motion montage of booby traps, brutal showdown between like all three of them in the house, a lot of motherfuckers in there, a lot of feet showing, you know, Tarantino classics. The N-word gets dropped a couple of times. Would you call this a Christmas movie? Because this is Tarantino's version of Home Alone. Would you call would you call this a Christmas movie?
Steve:If it is set around Christmas.
Ofili:Jesus fucking Christ.
Steve:If it is set around, because you're not mentioning that, you're not saying that. You're giving me you're painting the picture, but you're not painting the background, right? Okay. But it's set around Christmas. Right? Maybe. Like, what if you call Jesus the N-word? Like, what if the N-word drop falls?
Ofili:Okay, mate. Alright, mate. Let's Christmasify a couple movies right now. Wait, wait, sorry, before we go, what Tarantino were you talking about? I'm just giving an example of what a Tarantino Christmas movie would go like.
Steve:Yeah, then that's a Christmas film.
Ofili:Oh, Jesus Christ. Alright. Oppenheimer, there's there's like two there's a Christmas scene in there. Is that a Christmas movie? We see a Christmas movie and we see cheating.
Steve:No, no, it's not a Christmas movie because well, for one, like Christmas plays no role in the film. Like even in in when Christmas appears or during Christmas, it's not Christmas is not playing a role in it, right? It's the Christmas doesn't serve as a measure of time, Christmas doesn't serve as an added layer in the complexity of Oppenheimer's, like in the relationship or whatever going on. So it's not central to any subplots in it. So I wouldn't call Oppenheimer a Christmas film.
Ofili:Interesting. I I feel like with your definition, especially with the strong emphasis of love and crit and cheating. Just saying.
Steve:Okay.
Ofili:Let me think about another one real quick. I think snow is a good idea.
Steve:Actually, I just thought about no, go on. I think snow is also kind of an element of a Christmas film. But I'm not saying it's necessary. I don't think it's required, right? Not just winter, even snow, like issue four. All right. I'm not like doesn't mean that doesn't that's no needless to say it's not like all encompassing in the sense that like there's films that don't have snow in them that are Christmas films. Like if you say a Christmas movie night, obviously there's not going to be any snow in there. But I'm saying, like, it's it's a good shout, you know, like the girl with the dragon tattoo, all that snow underscores my belief that it's a Christmas film. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Go on.
Ofili:Okay, okay. I really don't wait. I don't even get this. I like you actually have me like thrown right now. Okay, in like Iron Man 3, there's a Christmas scene. Like, I think they have like a holiday party.
Steve:Is that a Christmas movie? Iron Man 3. Is that the one where he comes out to the world? I'm blanking.
Ofili:Or is that the shit? Is that this one? No, it's not the shittiest one, but it's the one where I think I forgot who the bad guy is, but I think that's the one that where he has all the suits fighting, the Iron Legion thing. Oh, yeah, Iron Man 3 is a Christmas movie. Yeah, I just remembered. I just looked it up. Yeah, yeah.
Steve:It is. Absolutely. Absolutely. What do you what do you mean? Christmas plays an element in it. Um, I'm trying to remember.
Ofili:It's not it's not it's not a big element. I don't feel like it's okay.
Steve:It's not a big element. You can call that a Christmas film, is what I'm saying.
Ofili:Okay, Shazam.
Steve:Shazam too. Yeah, absolutely. Yes, good child, bro.
Ofili:How is Shazam a fucking Christmas movie?
Steve:Because it's set around Christmas. Christmas is essential. One of the sisters comes home with something. The film changes if it's not Christmas. They get gifts, like it's set around Christmas Day. It is, it is a Christmas movie. Yeah. Yeah, thank you for saying that. Shazam would have entered mine, even tough.
Ofili:I'm disgusted. I'm actually surprised that you didn't say like no way home. No, no way home is because I feel like the last act is like just said during Christmas Day.
Steve:Yeah, but No Way Home is too. Bro, I've seen No Way Home a lot of the time. No way Home is too nostalgic for me to say it's Christmas. Right? Like even though, even though Strange, I think Strange mentions Christmas, and it's part of why he's being nice to you know, helping him, whatever. But I wouldn't call it a Christmas film because I feel like with the MCU, if they had set that film any other time, it was too multiversal for it to be Christmas, I think. Okay.
Ofili:Um how do we feel about Frozen? Is Frozen a Christmas movie? Because you talked about snow. And we have pine trees in the background. We even have we have we have reindeer and moose. Yeah. It's too funny, bro. Come on, how do we feel about that one?
Steve:There's not no damn Christmas movie, bro.
Ofili:Wow. You don't think frozen, you don't think you have a daughter right now? You're not gonna put on frozen for for like Christmas.
Steve:I won't put up frozen at any point during the year for my kid, you know, because it's like it's frozen, it's a kid movie. I don't think that's tied to Christmas, you know. I think this is this is very funny. You're you're kidding me. It doesn't have to be, it doesn't have to be in the name or it doesn't have to be in the poster. It doesn't have to be like bro, if it's just Christmassy, bro. If the film feels Christmassy, it's a Christmas film, bro. We don't get silver linings, yeah. Oh, another good one with um um what's a name? God J J Law and Brad Pitt. Bradley Cooper, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. That's a Christmas show. There we go. Bradley Cooper showing Brad Pitt that is a Christmas show, yeah.
Ofili:No, I I know what you're talking about. Civil Linning Playbook.
Steve:Yes, that is a Christmas film. Bro, we're cooking, we're cooking with gas. I can we can go on, bro.
Ofili:I'm actually fucking, I'm dying. Oh okay, the lobster. No, there's there's snow, there's a Christmas tree in the background. There is love. That film hates love. It's anti No, the film is literally all about finding love.
Steve:It's about finding love, but not love. Not real love, not love in the sense of love. It's about What would I even say it's about? Bro, that's not it's not Christmas. It's not love. It's not love in the sense of platonic, till like I love you, you love me. Nah, it's about love as a means of currency, of social currency. Like you need this in order to be a part of society. That's money, right?
Ofili:That's not love in the sense of what love means. I mean, they just said we need to, you know, population's kind of high. We should just start turning, you know, single people into you know animals. Yeah, I I I I kind of agree with that.
Steve:Yeah, so I don't think that's like love about about actual love. So I'm gonna call that Christmas. No, it hits it hates love.
Ofili:Oh man, you're actually telling me, okay, let me I'm thinking about let's not dwell too much in this. Okay, so so two things, two things now. I got two options right now. How would you turn the menu into a Christmas movie? The menu? Like Rafaines, Rafaines and uh Nicholas Holt. How would you turn that into a Christmas movie? If you had to, how would you do it?
Steve:If I had to turn that into a Christmas movie, how would I do that? Okay, for one, it had to I would have I would have said it somewhere different, not on like a remote, was it on the on the on the remote island or something? I would have said it was a remote island, yeah. I would have said it in like a village, like said it villagey, right? I wouldn't have made it about like the end of the climax in that they burn themselves up. Instead, it would have been a thing where it climaxes in her, realizing that Holt isn't for her, and she falls in love with like she f she finds a passion. Um your thing is is love. Like that this is maybe not because because the film is about like the relationship between Holt and Taylor Joy is romantic. That's why I'm using love in this sense. Like if it was family, maybe actually, yeah, Finds could be her father, right? And she gets to she goes, like Holt takes her to this village back. Holt takes her back home, right? Where her father is the head of a restaurant or whatever, and Finds and Taylor Joy have a hate relationship, like they don't talk or whatever. And Holt's whole thing is trying to fix that relationship, and that's why he's taking her back to her little village, remote village home, right? And the entire film, Finds and Taylor Joy are clashing. And then by the end of it all, we realize that Holt's driving you know motive wasn't necessarily out of love for Taylor Joy. He was it was out of like him trying to get on Finds' good book so he could get like approval and that's it.
Ofili:He didn't really, he he didn't really care.
Steve:He didn't because he knew what was going to happen and he still brought her on anyway. He didn't know what was going to happen, but he knew like it was bad and he still brought her on anyway. Yeah, he didn't care about her, and that's why that's true, that's true. That's why they clapped, bro. But what was I been trying to say? So the to change it, Mickey Mo Christmasy, it can be like in Holtz, like bringing them back, bringing her back home, and helps Taylor Joy realize that Holtz is not the man for her. And Taylor Joy finds, you know, purpose in what Ralph is has been doing this entire time, and like it brings them back together, and they share a wonderful Christmas meal together while kicking Holtz back home and sending back, breaking up with him, and like you know, now they're rekindled and it's family and love and all of that. That's a Christmas one. Put a Christmas tree in there in the middle of the restaurant, right? Sprinkle some snow around, Christmas decorations, instead of the waitresses and the waiters like burning themselves up, have them you know sing a carol or some shit. I don't know, but like that was that makes it worry about Christmasy, bro. Okay.
Ofili:I I kind of agree that maybe the menu is kind of easier to turn into a Christmas movie because I'm not gonna lie to you. I feel like you're going a little too far with this finding love and like you know, you're holding this love very, very heavy. I don't know. For me, I feel like if I was to change the menu into a Christmas movie, I'd probably just toss like toss in a big Christmas tree and maybe just like holiday themed dishes, like a lot of eggnog, maybe eggnog poisoning someone and still have them kill themselves.
Steve:Yeah, probably.
Ofili:No, bro, that is not Christmas.
Steve:Santa Claus for Santa Claus.
Ofili:So infidelity is Christmas, but murder isn't. This is interesting. This is very interesting. Um, okay, gonna give you a couple more options, then maybe we'll just like taper off, you know. Okay. Because I feel like, guys, this might be a shorter episode. We're enjoying this, but you know. Yeah, yeah, yeah. How would you make I'm thinking? How would you make Black Panther a Christmas movie? Wakanda Forever. Wakanda Forever, so part two? Because you know, we can't have snow. I'm dead, I freaking dead. Because that one is in Africa, we can't have snow. Unless the Wakanda is, you know, make a machine that makes snow.
Steve:How would I make Wakanda Forever on Christmasy? Yes. Okay, this is going to sound probably stupid. But instead of the Talocan being an underwater advanced Maya civilization, let's make the Talocan elves or Grinches, right? Oh my god. And let's make the pearl, the heart-shaped pearl thing herb that you have to drink to become. Let's make that the spirit of Christmas. And the Talocans are trying to steal that thing and destroy it because, or no, scratch that. Scratch that. Let's make vibranium be Christmas. Like, that's what makes Christmas run, right? And the Talocans also run on it, but they make it like bad and like you know, this green cheese version that makes them green or whatever. And so they're trying to take it and steal it and keep it for themselves while like Wakanda forever people, like Wakanda people are obviously like trying to propagate that to the world or whatever. And instead of Shuri becoming the Black Panther, Shuri's becoming Santa. Santa's dead, they have the funeral for Santa. It's all white at Christmas, and Shuri needs to, instead of like just taking it and like drinking it and like the power of the Black Panther when I'm be with you. No, you have to actually like grow and become like embody the spirit of Nicholas Claws to become Santa. And so Shuri defeats the Talekans by you know, she tries at first using rage from like losing the ex Santa, loses, and then she goes back and journeys and embodies the spirit of Santa and uses Vibranium, which is the spirit of Christmas, to defeat the Talekans, i.e., the prinches. And that's a Christmas film right there. You know what?
Ofili:I I'm actually fucking dying because you know, if I I feel like if I ask you about like Dune, how do you how to make Dune Christmasy? You're gonna be like, oh, they should host like a festival of lights, and they cover the Shy Hulud and all the other worms with like Christmas hats and lights. You're actually killing me. They bring Christmas cheers or Arrakis.
Steve:Man, any film can be a Christmas film if you're locking hard enough. People say the Godfather trilogy is Christmas or Christmassy.
Ofili:There you go. I will say there are very heavy unlike your very elaborate Christmas Christmassification of some of these very non-Christmas movies. Yeah, I feel like the Godfather trilogy all have like pretty good like Christmas scenes. There's almost always a Christmas dinner or like a holiday, yeah. But they all come together, which I feel like Christmas is more centered around traditional Christmas movies, are more centered around spending time with family. Yeah, yeah. That's fine. Not not all this love, hollow baloo, my guys going on here.
Steve:It's it's love, it's the spirit of Christmas, it's it's family, you know, it's friendship. Whichever one, like those are they don't all have to be present, but like one or in varying capacities have to be present for me.
Ofili:That's fair enough. I think I think the presence of a Christmas tree and maybe I I don't know, it's snow, I don't know. I feel like with our definition, like it's not really that hard to call something like the shining a Christmas movie. I don't say I didn't say snow must be present too.
Steve:That's not what I said. I said snow helps engage it, you know, like a little bit of dashing snow.
Ofili:I mean, let me tell you the holiday elements in the shining. So the shining, we have snow, we have a cabin, we have like a Christmas holiday kind of cabin. We have snow, we have isolation from, you know, because you know, you're not going to work, you're spending time with family. We have family tension because what is the holiday without finding with your family a little bit? That oh, how's work been? Why aren't you married? Like, you know, and then I just feel like that's those are like the three main themes you need for like the shining to be to be a Christmas movie and it is. Yeah.
Steve:Sorry, I just remembered something I wanted to say about Iron Man 3. Okay, come on. At the end of it, I just I'm remembering the film as we talk. I think he blows up, he blows up, he's like, Come on, it's Christmas. Like he says, come on, it's Christmas, or what whatever it's Christmas. He blows up some of the suits because that's when he has like all these suits that are like and he blows them up and it's like fireworky. That's a Christmas film if I've ever seen one, my guy. That's Christmas right there. But anyway, I get what you're saying. Yeah, I I think it's not like necessarily the parts make the whole, which is I'm I guess I agree with you. It's not necessarily like different parts of Christmas like make the whole, but it's the sense, it's the whole, right? I think. I think. But all right, Steve, you're killing me. If we each had to recommend one film, okay, our listeners, because we're going to, I'm guessing we're getting this out soon enough. If we had to recommend one Christmas or one holiday theme film for our listeners to watch before the end of this year, what would it be? I feel like we'd both go holdovers though. Okay, yeah, you got it.
Ofili:Okay, so I'd say, okay, at the risk of not, let's give them more options. I think if you can find Tokyo Godfather anywhere, that is that's fucking amazing. Um wait, back it up. You know, never mind. I was gonna bring up something about Edward Scissorhands being a Christmas movie, but I don't want to get into that. I don't want to get into that because you've got me thinking very, very annoying things right now. Um, but yeah, I think Suck Your Godfather or Klaus. Klaus by Netflix actually was pretty good as a Christmas movie. Okay. Yeah.
Steve:Okay. Yeah. I think I wasn't going to say uh the holdovers, but I I agree. That's that's how you gonna say then. Um Little Woman, and which was which would have been my fifth movie if we did five, but we did four. Um Little Woman is again another, I feel you might say annoying pick since it's not about Christmas, but it is very much a Christmas film. They're singing they're singing carols in it. I don't know what to tell you. It's released, it's released in December. I don't know if it's Christmas Day, but it's released like Christmas week.
Ofili:The Cinephiles Christmas, man.
Steve:There's singing carols in it, bro. There's no, but yeah, Little Woman, it's one of my it's also exactly Timmy gets to marry Florence Pierce, exactly. Not his first choice, but he does get to marry her.
Ofili:So yeah, all right, man. Ladies and gentlemen, this has been another episode of the Cinephiles I. This is a shorter episode, we completely understand that. But last episode was our longest episode by a good bit. So I hope you guys enjoy that. You know, it's gonna average out, but yeah, this has been a great episode, and yeah, you can reach back out and tell us more movies that you think are not Christmas movies, or movies that you you think should be counted in the Christmas movie lottery. So we love that. So hope you guys have a great day, and yeah, we're signing off.
Steve:Happy holidays, all happy holidays.
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